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Blackjack Technically legal?

Koontz

New Member
Messages
62
Is blackjack card counting technically legal? I know it's frowned upon and most casinos won't put up with card counting players but is it legal, though?
 

Stealth

Member
Messages
150
This is one of the biggest misconceptions about card counting.

There is nothing illegal about using your mind to play a game they offer to the public. I do not use computers or any thing else that assist me.

The casino recognizes your skill (or thinks they do!!) by your betting patterns and some of your playing decisions as well as your long term winning record.

It is my biased opinion that it is ethically bankrupt to offer a game to the public and only allow those they can beat play. If they don't like it, then change the game to stop counters, which will also lose them lots of customers and revenue.
 

zohan

Member
Messages
98
As much as card counting isn't illegal, I've heard it said that casinos somehow have the right to deny service to anyone if at the end of the day, they deem the player to have an advantage over the house. One thing though, do card counting skills really matter in Blackjack?
 

JackBlack

New Member
Messages
34
I have never heard that it's illegal; although casinos don't like it. But is there a way for them to actually prove that the player is counting cards?
 

Stealth

Member
Messages
150
Prove, perhaps with a detailed review of the play. Surveillance has people who know how to count and can follow along with you to determine if you are playing with an advantage. Mostly they want to know if you increased your bet with positive high counts, if you did then they ASSUME you are counting.

Surveillance has software that allows the operator to enter every card as it is played and the system will tell you if you are playing with an an advantage.

If I sit down at your table and you are counting cards, I will know you are counting based on your plays and betting in less than two shoes.
 

clyne

New Member
Messages
78
If I sit down at your table and you are counting cards, I will know you are counting based on your plays and betting in less than two shoes.
You are churning really helpful information and I get the feeling that you have been playng for a while. What I've heard (and you'll probably have to validate this) is that card counting is allowed in the US. My opinion has always been that a card counter doesn't necessarily alter the outcome of a deal.
 
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Stealth

Member
Messages
150
Card counting is not illegal.

Card counting lets the player know when the statistical advantage is in his favor rather than the casinos favor. If he then bets more at this time he can beat the casino IN THE LONG TERM. The statistical range of probable results (standard deviation) are very wide and you can loose any session EVEN if you have the statistical advantage. Winning takes quality execution of your skill, a big bank roll to withstand the wins and losses and perseverance to play enough rounds to get to the law of large numbers.
 

Talulah

New Member
Messages
13
It's great to know it's not illegal to count cards because I really feel like that is the only way that I will ever be able to win in the long run so that is the main focus of my lessons.
 

Sevens

New Member
Messages
81
It's great to know it's not illegal to count cards because I really feel like that is the only way that I will ever be able to win in the long run so that is the main focus of my lessons.
Just be careful about it because if a player is obvious about counting cards, they will get kicked out. Unless the casino is winning anyway because they aren't very good at it.
 

Stealth

Member
Messages
150
First, if you are good, then you WILL get caught sooner or later. This is why I encourage new counters to do their homework on issues of surveillance and playing styles to protect their longevity.

THE WORST THING YOU CAN DO IS USE A PLAYERS CARD TO GET THE FREE SHIT. The comps will never be more than the cost of being banned at a casino. Big negative play. Longevity is king.

Being backed off, counter measures and trespassed are the bane of card counters. I have been dealt with by one or more of these in 10 casinos and am the un-proud member of the Oregon Surveillance Network website of card counters, cheats and miscreants used by most casinos to track low life's like me. LOL I am being sarcastic but accurate.

Casinos obsession with card counters is ignorant and is financially detrimental to their own well being. There are so few who have the ability and the bankroll to materially effect them and the cost of their counter measures is so high in lost revenue, that I am amazed that the bean counters have not figured it out!
 

AlltheAces

New Member
Messages
84
Casinos may be obsessed with card counters, but at least all the security also reduces the chances of the actual illegal cheats like dealer/player collusion.

As others have said, cardcounting may not be illegal, but casinos don't like people taking their money so they look out for it. Not every casino will throw players out for it, since having someone playing and winning at an otherwise empty table encourages other players to join, but it depends entirely on the casino's policy and the situation.
 

AlltheAces

New Member
Messages
84
Not sure, but this sounds like it was spoken by a true casino manger. Are you?
No, or I'd be a lot richer. I do know a few players turned casino security and some of their stories are hair-raising. My friend's wife once demonstrated a fake shuffle and middle deal to give out whatever hands she wanted players to have. I couldn't catch her and I was sitting across the table knowing she was doing it!
 
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